turn out

I know I know I’m a whiner blah blah blah

When was there bracket racing involved?? The only brackets were in the Trohpy class ... It had 3 entries if I recall right. Did you actually call and talk to someone about the rules?? There are a few rules that are let go. We had a few fast cars from the Phoenix area. There were 4 Buick GNs, one is nationally known. The rules change every year, some for the better, perhaps next year some other will be changed to allow you to run your car. Take care and maybe we will see you then??

The idea of running so we please the street racers who don't want to live by a set of rules may sound like a easy thing to do. And I personally would be interested in attempting to put that together if you would do one simple thing for me. You contact the insurance company that would provide the required amount of insurance needed by the City of Kingman and that's $5,000,000.00. If you can be successful at that then by all means please let get together and see if we could get that going I think the idea is great but there is always a practical side to everything and to be honest that's were we have to function.
I cant find the rule that said anything about "smog" you will have to point that out for me and as far as brackets as retorq aid there were three cars running brackets out of over 200 that were here.
Sorry you guys missed all the fun because that's what it was and I wouldn't have changed anything......maybe we will see you in the future.
Thanks for the feed back it always helps, good or bad.
Brian

All the rules that I read and it would appear that everyone else’s read was the same. And it was directed towards bracket racing as for the insurances … you know I don’t need this sort of sarcasm from you! Remember I would be your customer if I would have gone. As for your insurances all you need to do sometimes is ask for a little help maybe some sponsors for the event….I don’t know just maybe a though here. As for the practical side … I guess you are saying that I am not practical… nice way to insult a potential sponsor or this event. Let me ask this did you not understand the illustration or case and point I was making by the smog statement? I was serious when I said I had 20+ people in addition to the people whom work here at the shop. I was thinking possible I could relay some info that reached us that was possibly incorrect and why more people were not there, however if you are content with the turn out that that is fine just act as if I said nothing and ill go about my day getting read to go to other races in other states.

Also you mentioned insurance …. Uhm seeing as how it is a street race then how can you have insurance? That part seriously puzzles me? I know what I have to have insurance wise as a business and it is in the same realm. I also understand the difficulties that you are faced with when doing events such as this.

Have a nice Day

You seem to have taken things in the wrong context...I never meant anything as sarcasm I was very serious when I said if you can find an insurance company to insure a race as you suggested it would be very good.Good enough I would be very willing to make it happen. If you would like I will give you the name of our insurance agent we use and let you run some of the particulars by them to see if we can make it fly. You need not be defensive when I made the comment about practical I was referring to know one but us, meaning Route 66 Wings and Wheels Inc. We have a lot of very good idea given to us after every event and my comment only referred to the fact we have to brake them down into things we can actually accomplish, never meant for you to think I was referring to you.You made a very good point when you said to remember you would be our customer, that has been my philosophy from the start that most tracks forget that and I have always preached it should be our biggest concern. I mean if you go to a restaurant that serves bad food and lousy service then shame on you for going back, right.I think tracks need to be held accountable too.So just another reason to show you why I would mean to be sarcastic. You have never met me or you would know that. I like to think I am up front and honest and I will say what I think but I am also open minded enough to listen to any ideas.
As far as the rules we use for our event they were originally written by one of our directors who was and is a bracket race. That's probably why they are that way but we are never against making them better. You do understand the line we need to follow regarding any safety issue's since we do provide such huge insurance for the event. They mandate we follow the sanctioning body rules not us. You say you own a business then you are fully aware of what I am talking about. They tell you what you can and cant do right?
Again I thank you for even taking the time to give the comments, I love Drag Racing and have been working at this for almost ten years. I dont profess to even begin to know everything about our sport , but we try hard. I think the results of the weekend speak for that too.Sorry you guys didn't come, maybe in the future.

BigB
Brian Devincenzi
President
Route 66 Wings and Wheels Inc.

DanB as I said the rules change ... Like BigB mentioned ALOT of the rules were laid in place by local NHRA bracket guys ... there are some rules that do need to be looked at. There was a couple rules that were changed this year after some discussion, I have a list of about 4 or 5 more that need to be addresses before our next event. Email me your list, webmaster@kingmanstreetdrags.com and I'll make sure they are looked at before the next event. We'll see what we can do about getting some more fast cars here next time, you included.

The rules were in place for a reason, and though they were a bit too much for such a short strip, they weren't that hard to follow, but I personally had to put up with alot of BS over the weekend. Namely, having all of my times thrown out for running slicks once on not even my fastest time during OPEN running(heaven forbid I should be thinking about NOT fishtailing the whole 330ft), and someone even threatened to throw me out if I ran them again??? I was under the impression it was open running, so I might just go to Pro Street or Trophy class if slicks made a difference even though no one in trucks really cared about my slicks.
And what happened to real open running where we could grudge match people in other classes? I was looking forward to running a couple of my buddies, but we never got the chance. Parking was another problem. I had a gentleman tell me I couldn't park in one place because it was a fire lane, and then a yellow car was parked where I was, and the same guy was standing right near it watching the owner walk away. I really enjoyed the past two years' events, but the way I was treated this year, I would rather spend the $200+ of admission and gas to stay in Tucson to go Bracket racing and save the other $150 When people such as myself who travel over 300 miles (and skip class) to make this event are treated like I was, I don't know how you expect to have a decent turnout next year.

Hey Steve-o ... I'm guessing by your sig you were truck 402?? The rules are VERY simple, no slicks in the truck class. It said it in black and white in the program and on BOTH our web sites. If you wanted to run slicks OR open headers you run in the Pro class. You yourself just said "they weren't that hard to follow" ... As for the "no one in trucks really cared about my slicks" comment, that's not true. I can name at least 3 people that would not have agreed with that if they had been asked.

Do you recall who you ran the slicks against?? I do ...

Are you 100% sure your "fastest" time wasn't on slicks?? The #8 time was your 6.035 or so time which you for sure had slicks on. The #9 time was you, it was a 6.1something I believe. The times were close enough to lead the race officials to believe you ran slicks on both passes, therefore both were tossed. Your #3 "open" run didn't count towards the quick 8 ... perhaps that was your fastest run?? That run I'll give ya, was on drag radials. I have no idea what time you ran and like I said it didn't count so it doesn't really matter.

As for the parking, if what you said really transpired the way you say then you should have went to someone and had it corrected. If I were told I couldn't park somewhere and then watched someone else park there and get away with it I would be irate!! That shouldn't have happened.

"Open running" obviously wasn't true open running ... the first two should have been named "Time Trials" ... the third and any passes after the two should have been true open runs. Wanna run slicks, go ahead, it doesn't count. Wanna run your buddy on his bike, go ahead, it doesn't count. Unfortunately that's not been the case the last two years. We haven't had a real grudge match time slot ... it's on my list of things to be discussed for the next event. It was hugely successful in KSD3 and a lot of guys like yourself want to see it brought back.

You know Steve-o you had a good point about were did grudge races go....trust me they will be back next time.It was not our intention to get rid of them and that's what this was supposed to be about.
Now as far as you running slicks in truck class, sorry the rules don't allow it.We cant poll the class entry's and see if changes are OK with them or not. That's why the rules are written before the event. As far as the event had too many rules you need to understand the requirements it takes to get a five million dollar insurance policy for this event then you might understand why so many rules, they are not always by choice.
As for the parking I think retorq said it correctly when he pointed out if you were treated wrong please say something and we will do what we can to fix it.
You need to know that all of these people who make this happen only get one shot a year to get it right and on top of that they are all volunteers and need to be cut a little slack. I am not saying what they did to you was right, just asking for patience when they make mistakes.
We were glad you came and sorry if you don't feel like coming again. Thanks for the time and effort to come and we appreciate the feedback as it all helps.

BigB, you seem to be more interested in being constructive, and I appreciate that. I was hoping to post here to see that improvements would be made for next year.

Retorq, my first run was on drag radials, and I ran 6.4xx. My second run was a 6.3xx on my slicks. Yes, I am 100% sure of it. My third run was the 6.0, and I never saw where it said that run wouldn't count. Even so, my 6.1 should have gotten me in, and I tried talking to the people at registration, but no one really seemed to care or even listen to me and didn't direct me towards who to talk to. I wasn't going to make a big deal out of the parking space, and I'm sure you guys didn't have time to come sort out a parking space. Like I said, the rules were there for a reason, so I understand no slicks in truck class, and therefore, I wouldn't have minded having my slicks time counting for Pro class, but threatening to throw me out? That's a bit ridiculous especially considering that I not once tried to hide it, and I was more than polite through the whole thing.

Just a question? Do you see more people interested in just running grudge type races or do you think guys and gals like the classes?
I am no a big fan of the classes and the only reason they are here is so we have like cars running like cars.The audience would be confused if you ended up running the alcohol funny car, but I think there are a lot of guys that want to match up outside there classes.And as far as I am concerned I would run anything against the funny car I still say I would have the best seat in the house.....
Just my opinion
Last and truly not least, you should never have been threatened about being thrown out unless you disrespected the staff. The rules violation only excluded you from the quick eight it had nothing to do with you continueing to run all weekend.
Like I said before, hope you decide to come again..........anyway thanks for coming this year and thanks for the feedback I am sure one way or the other it will lead to a better time in the future.

Only the first two runs counted towards the 'Quick 8', the field was set when you ran your 6.0. I'm not sure when you ran a 6.1 ...

If you threw slicks on your truck you can't just run pro, you have to be registered in that class to begin with.

I'm the one you talked to in registration, I talked to you several times over the weekend. I'm also the one who was running T95, the White 95 Tahoe. Look at your time slip for the run with the slicks, that was me you ran against. When we got back to the trailer and you came and got your time slip I told you running slicks in truck class was against the rules. Your response was more or less "Ohh", no "Ohh I'm sorry" or "Ohh I didn't realize that" or "That won't happen again I promise". What would have happened if you didn't run against me and get called on the slicks?? Would you have changed back?? Your illegal run got you into the top 8 ... You understand the dilemma correct??

I think most of the racers wanted to have classes, but still have time for running grudge matches. That way you can run your buddy, but still have fair matchups for eliminations. I would suggest the setup from two years ago where you have open running all day and then just take the fastest runs by each class for eliminations.

Retorq, I was trying to find out what would work on that track. By the time I came to get my first two time slips (a 6.4 and a 6.3), my slicks were already off my truck since they didn't help me any, and you even told me that if I wanted to run slicks I'd have to change classes. I wasn't running them anymore, so I wasn't going to change classes. Later after I got my next two times, I came to talk to you about why my third run was thrown out, and after explaining the situation, you really weren't explaining why my fastest run (not on slicks) was thrown out other than "well, you ran slicks." Finally, you said something like "OK...um....well...we just register people," so I figured you must not have been very informed on why my run was DQ'd. You seem very sure of it now, so did you look back and review your tapes, or have you just been trying to heckle me this whole time?

SteveO, the third run wasn't thrown out ... only the first two counted. That part wasn't up to me, keeping track of everyone's runs all day and picking the top is a nightmare and next to impossible on the system we're currently using. I didn't know until my third run that the first two were the only ones that counted towards the 'Quick 8'. I wasn't aware any run got 'thrown out' until Sat nite. Your slicks run was the #8 quick run, my only intention was to make sure that specific run wasn't in the top 8, nothing more. It wasn't my call to have all the runs thrown out, that was a call made by the race staff, not the registration staff. Asking registration staff why your times were tossed is like asking the video crew where to pick up your driver goodie bags. They may know but it's not their area of expertise and you really need to goto the source to get your info.

I'm not trying to heckle you, this is the way I see it, tell me if I'm wrong. You showed up on drag radials, tech into the truck class then decided to change your tires to 'illegal' tires and make a run (or two). You happened to run against one of the 12 or so department heads that busted their ass to put on this event. You got caught 'cheating', the one run I know for sure you cheated on happened to get you into the eliminations, that run was tossed, your other runs that may have been faster did not count because the field was already set. You are now here complaining that you cheated and got your times tossed ... you aren't going to get any sympathy from me. If I showed up to an event that was held for fun and cheated and got caught and didn't get kicked out of the event, I would be grateful. If you showed up to a PSCA or NHRA event and cheated I'm pretty sure the outcome would have been the exact same, you're getting bounced from eliminations at the very least. You don't see it that way??

Like I keep saying, I never tried to hide the fact that I ran slicks...once Everytime someone asked me about them I made no attempt to hide the fact I ran them... once, and I made it clear I wasn't running them again. Like I said, I was under the impression that "open" running was a test 'n tune (like an NHRA or PSCA event), so I was testing the slicks vs DR's. I don't know why you would think I would try running through eliminations in truck class with slicks thinking no one would notice. Now, you're saying only the first two runs counted, and that would in fact mean my slicks time of 6.3 was the #8 which makes sense since I think the slowest truck in eliminations was about in that range. However, earlier you said I had the #8 and #9 slots with 6.0 and 6.1 which I definitely didn't run on my first two passes...

You know this whole slicks or no slicks caused many other problems. I had to DQ a car in Hot Rod right as they were about to run the quick four. As they were sitting in the staging lanes the tech inspectors noticed the tires. Now the guy admitted he had them on all weekend and said it was our fault for not noticing it in tech inspection,WOW!!I could believe he thought he should still be able to compete. I asked him "OK so you cheated two times before now and we should let you cheat for a third time" and his answer was yes!! He truly didn't understand that I was disqualifying him from the competition. That didn't mean he couldn't run but I couldn't let him compete and he was very angry with us for that.
I don't mean to imply you were doing anything like him Steve-o its just that the tires were more issues then just yours.
All I hope is that we can solve all of these minor problems before we do it again...I don't mean to make your problem sound minor either but when you look at what we have to do to put this whole thing it is one of the more small hurdles, if you know what I mean. Don'T give up on us we appreciate the effort it takes to come to our event, remember we are all doing this to ultimately benefit all of us drag racer by finally building a new track and not follow history and tear down another old one.

I know it doesn't seem it but I appreciate your input too SteveO. We know that we have to watch the parking staff a lil better next time, make sure they are treating everyone the same. Also the more people that come and say they want true open running and grudge matches back makes it easier for us to decide what to do in the future too.